5 K-12 Transitions and Supports

Speakers: Scott Beddall, Ministry of Education and Sam Jingfors, Safer Schools Together

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Video Transcript

Jennifer Jordan: I’d like to welcome back [Carrie 00:00:06] from the Ministry of Advanced Education Skills and Training to give us a little bit of context for our next session. Thank you.

Carrie Dusterhoft: Hi, everyone. Just a really quick context piece for the K to 12 agenda item that we have coming up. One of the themes that came up frequently in our outreach campaign feedback was the need for the K to 12 and PSI sectors to work more closely together to insure better transitions for students. So, through some initial discussions with Scott, who you’ll be hearing from shortly, it became apparent to us that there were a lot of things going on in the K to 12 sector that aligned with areas of interest on the post-secondary side.

Carrie Dusterhoft: So, we think there may be some good opportunities to build on the work in the K to 12 sector, to partner or to leverage resources, but we thought it was important to have that discussion at the forum to help guide us in terms of where we might focus our efforts. So, I would be very interested to hear if something sparks from this discussion that Scott and Sam will have today, and if so, please add any thoughts that come up on the graffiti walls. So with that, I’d like to introduce Scott Beddall from the Ministry of Education, and Sam Jingfors from Safer Schools Together.

Scott Beddall: Okay. So, hi everyone. My name’s Scott Beddall. I’m the Director of Wellness and Safety with Ministry of Education, and I really appreciate the opportunity to be here. I’m going to talk a little bit about the overall sort of context and background about what we’re doing in K to 12 around the students’ safety, and then I’m going to pass it over to my colleague, Sam, who’s going to dive into some of the services and supports that they provide to our schools.

Scott Beddall: So, to start things off, I’ve been working in healthy schools for over 12 years now with Ministries of Heath and Education at different times. Thanks, Sam. One of the things that’s been really great to see over the last little while is an increased recognition of the importance of student wellness and safety in their broader approach to learning in K to 12. It felt like for a while it was kind of like, “Hey, we’re over here. We’ve over here. We’re trying to do some good stuff.” Now it’s built into our Ministry’s policy for student success as healthy and effective learning environments, really on sort of the idea that students need to feel safe, they need to fell well, in order to learn effectively.

Scott Beddall: Then a lot of our actual work around student safety in K to 12 has been under our erase strategy, which stands for expect, respect, and a safe education. I’ll give a little bit of history on this. Erase started back in 2012, and it really was in response to some high profile and largely incidents where bullying was quite at the center of it, and there were some pretty tragic outcomes. It I think caused our sector to just really step back and think about, “What do we do to address this issue which is fairly pervasive? And we’re going to need something that is more than a one-off, more than an out-of-the-box program. We’re going to need something that’s quite comprehensive.”

Scott Beddall: So, we launched it as a five year strategy, and there were 10 points to it. I won’t speak to each of those points in detail, but I’m kind of reflecting some of the three key categories here. One of the most important, I would say, is the people. Really trying to create a bit of a provincial infrastructure to support student safety. One of the top pieces of it was a team of provincial subject matter experts, which includes Sam and some of his colleagues from Safer Schools Together, and we were really lucky to have them in our backyard. They’re based in White Rock. They’ve got this tremendous amount of expertise in the models of violence and threat risk assessment, digital threat assessment, and so forth.

Scott Beddall: Then stemming down from them, there is a requirement for every school district to designate a safe school coordinator who would be that point lead person who would be responsible for prevention initiatives, responding to student safety incidents, et cetera. Then as part of the violence threat risk assessment model, team is a really critical piece of that. So, it’s the recognition that you need to have these multidisciplinary teams to be able to really pull together all the information you’re looking for when you’re dealing with an incident, and also to be able to provide the wraparound supports for students and families in response to those incidents. So, in the districts, the Safe School coordinator team, Safe School coordinators, sorry, interfacing with law enforcement partners, MCFD, Child and Youth Mental Health, other key agencies, which can vary depending on what the community is.

Scott Beddall: Then together, you’ve got this connected infrastructure where the districts and the schools can access the provincial subject matter leads for support, and they can access each other to share information across, and it creates a very effective way to share information and ideas. Complementing that, we’ve got then also policy piece, so every school district required to implement a Safe School code of conduct, which really outline what are the acceptable and unacceptable sort of behaviors. What is sort of the recourse when there’s a violation of that code of conduct. Also requiring a specific reference to all of the prohibited grounds for discrimination in the BC human rights code.

Scott Beddall: Then a third key element was really the capacity building. So again, through the Safer Schools Together team, training, multilevel training, from everything from insuring safe and caring schools, like how do you create positive and connected school climates, all the way up to advanced violence threat risk assessment techniques, digital threat assessment, and all the stuff that Sam’s going to dive into in a moment here. The other piece I’ll say about the training is, again, it sort of reflects that team approach. It’s designed to be taken by not just school district staff, but their community partners, so you’re all learning together with a consistent model and approach, and it sort of helps cement and support that working together after the training’s over.

Scott Beddall: Yeah. Over 18,000 people have been trained so far and growing, so it has been a really important piece of what we’re doing. Then, the resources piece, the support doesn’t end after the training’s over. So, we have a multiyear services agreement with Safer Schools Together, and part of that contract means that the school districts or the schools can contact them whenever they need to to say, “I’ve got an issue that is quite complicated. How do I deal with this? How do I walk through this?” Or maybe there’s already been an incident and I need support. It could be anything in terms of communicating with parents or media. It could be how to just walk through and insure you’ve got safety plans and supports for all the students involved. It’s been a really critical piece, I think, of our system, is to have that support in place.

Scott Beddall: Then we have a website with lots of information for educators and parents, and we also launched, I think it as back in 2013, an anonymous online reporting tool for students. Sort of reflecting what I’ve heard at different points today, as has been said in a few spaces, not everybody feels comfortable sort of putting their hands up to say that they’re concerned with something or that something’s happened to them. So, this reporting tool is on the erase site, allows them to submit a report where it automatically goes to the designated safe school coordinator for that district or school, and then they can respond quickly. The student has the option to provide their personal information, but they don’t have to.

Scott Beddall: One of the things, we think a lot of things have been really great and successful like for the five years that erase was started, but we also recognized the landscape was changing pretty substantially. Like back in 2012, some of the social media apps that are pretty prolific right now were just not happening. Some of the complicated, very complicated safety incidents that schools have to deal with can really tax their resources. Then we’ve seen a growing, and this is a good thing, recognition and discussion about mental health issues that youth are dealing with, about some of the challenges for LGBTQ students. So overall, all of this led us to look at, we need to really refresh the strategy and expand it and change the way we’re doing some things in order to properly support students the best we can.

Scott Beddall: So, over the last year we’ve been expanding erase, the first two pillars are really about the safety piece, prevention and support. But again, not such a bullying specific focus. Bullying is still in the picture, but including a lot of the other types of issues that youth and schools are facing. Then also mental health and sexual orientation and gender identity, kind of encompassing a lot of our work around student safety and wellbeing. Really, we’re really looking at the next five years to focus on, how do we increase the reach and the impact and the sustainability of the work we’re doing?

Scott Beddall: So, like we’ve been hearing here, sexual violence and sexual misconduct have been growing areas of concern for our sector as well, and we’ve been talking to our school districts and talking to our partners about, you know, what are the best ways to try and address and prevent these types of incidents, and similarly as with the work we’ve done today, looking at the need to take a comprehensive approach. So, I’m just going to talk a little bit about some of the things we’re trying to do in that area that have an impact on this.

Scott Beddall: I think one of the key pieces on our prevention piece obviously is the education component, and so we have been rolling out a new provincial curriculum for K to 12 over the last few years. Part of that includes a new physical and health education curriculum which includes a dedicated stream around social and community health. Some of the pieces around that are learning outcomes related to, how do you develop and maintain healthy relationships? How do you avoid or respond to instances of exploitation or abuse? What about discrimination and bullying and harassment and that type of thing?

Scott Beddall: Also looking at working with partners to develop learning resource to support teachers in delivering that curriculum. So, with public safety and solicitor general, working to develop a respectful futures resource which was sort of premised around some work on domestic violence, and again, building the skillsets to help students take positive and healthy approaches when they’re developing their relationships. Also looking at our sexual health education resources and building in important pieces like consent and boundaries, and some of the pieces that aren’t in your traditional sex ed type of approaches. Overall, really, I think we’re looking to build out student competencies, the knowledge and skills to help really support their success both while they’re in our system, but also as they transition out into post-secondary and into career and life in total.

Scott Beddall: Then we’re doing a lot of work around mental health, like across government. So, there’s a cross government effort to do a child and youth mental health strategy. We’ve started some work in terms of providing some supports to districts where they can move forward social emotional learning, trauma informed practice, mental health literacy, and we’re still at the very early stages of that, but there’s going to be a lot more work to come, which is great.

Scott Beddall: Another key piece is, in terms of partnerships, we’ve been working with some of our other sectors to develop some best practice, how do we work together? So, developing with public safety and solicitor general in the law enforcement sector, how can schools work together with their law enforcement partners using best practices to prevent and respond to school safety issues? So, we’ve got a draft set of provincial guidelines which we’re looking to be rolling out in the fall, and then some other guides around how school districts can work with their partners locally to develop those community multidisciplinary teams that I was referring. Again, to have that common approach to supporting students and families.

Scott Beddall: Another piece is, we have a MyEd BC student information system which captures a lot of information, and one of the things we had heard from our school districts is that sometimes there might be a student who had a fairly significant incident where there was a violence and threat risk assessment of a pretty serious nature on them. They disappear out of one district. They reappear in another district. Nobody knew anything about it, and the supports and the safety plans aren’t in place, and it’s highly concerning. So, one of the things we’re in the process of doing is adding a field into our student information system which is really a trigger for communication. It’s not intended to be labeling a student or to be gathering a whole bunch of data on students who have violence threat risk assessments.

Scott Beddall: But if a student has had a moderate to severe violent and threat risk assessment, it basically indicates that that has happened, this is the district that it originated at and the date, and it’s only accessible by some of the higher administration and Safe School coordinators so they can trigger a conversation and reach out to the originating school district Safe School coordinator and, “Could you tell me a little bit about what you had in place in terms of safety and supports for this student so we can insure some continuity here?” Obviously that has a lot of sensitivities to it in terms of respecting privacy, and so we’re going through a lot of efforts to make sure that’s done properly, and we want to avoid unintended consequence. But, to try and address that issue of where there’s a lack of information sharing that can lead to some problems down the road.

Scott Beddall: Then the last piece I’ll mention before I pass it over to Sam is just some of the work in terms of our safe school environment. So, as part of the refresh of erase, we’ve updated our anonymous reporting tool, whereas before it was, again, quite specific on bullying and violence, and now there’s a range of categories that students can report on. Everything from sexual harassment, racism, discrimination, assault, lots of different pieces. The idea is basically, we’re doing a lot of work including Safer Schools Together has rolled out a lot of information sessions to students across communities across BC to let them know about this and really to encourage that culture of, if you see something, say something. So, even if it hasn’t happened to you specifically but you’re seeing it happen to people you know, say something, and then someone can actually do something about it, is the idea.

Scott Beddall: The Kamloops-Thompson School District, you may have heard in the past year and a bit, had a couple of very high profile issues around sexual misconduct in schools involving, at least one of which, some startlingly young kids. It kind of had them step back a bit and say, “We need to take another look at how we’re addressing sexual misconduct in our schools,” so they created a cross sector task force and created some recommendations, and they’re now in the process of implementing those in terms of a whole new set of policies and procedures. It made me think of the presentation earlier today by [Myrna 00:15:04] which is we’re looking at, how do you take a compassionate and caring approach to all the people how are involved in that, and really building, like through training and capacity, the staff and other partners who are going to be working together on that piece.

Scott Beddall: So as part of that, we’re looking to work with the Office of the Ombudsperson prevention programs, and the Kamloops school district to look at, how do we take that and have that available to all of our school districts provincially? So, that’s going to be an important work in progress. Then lastly, the erase training that I mentioned and this incident support. So, Safer School Together is regularly updating their training to reflect these important issues and emerging trends, so that’s getting built into the training that we’re continuing to roll out to our school districts and partners. They’ve done some of that work also with post-secondary institutions in terms of for preservice teachers or for campus staff, and that’s been actually really great in helping to support some of the linkages between our systems.

Scott Beddall: So, I just want to put that out there that there’s always an opportunity or an invitation if you’re ever interested in terms of attending a training and checking it out, or having a discussion about what that could look like for your institution, we totally welcome that conversation. If you want to connect with your local school district to find out a bit more of that work, they’re always open to chatting about that, too. But, as I pass it over, we’re very keen to be learning from what you’re doing, sharing what we’re doing, and really looking at how we can sort of enhance and make connections between our systems to help our students sort of move along nicely. So, I’ll now pass it over to Sam and he will dazzle you with some of the details here.

Sam Jingfors: Thank you, Scott. Let’s give a hand for Hugh Grant, Scott Beddall. Fantastic, Scott, and I say that as the most endearing compliment I could possibly give you. Good afternoon, folks. In the short time that I have with you here today, I wanted to cover a little bit about just building upon what Scott had mentioned around how we currently support school districts throughout the province, public school districts, and then hoping to be able to build on that and expand around some of the linkages to the post-secondary institutions and how we can bridge some of that work that we’re doing already to support school districts over into the PSI sector. But then I wanted to also show you a couple of excerpts from, for example, our digital threat assessment training, what that tangibly looks like, knowing that many of you are working with survivors and victims of sexualized violence on campus and within communities, and what some of those technology pieces that we touch on throughout our professional level of training.

Sam Jingfors: So, in addition to the training piece that Scott mentioned, we also do work with students across the province with those information sessions around wanting to get really a lot of awareness out there around the anonymous reporting tool, how it can be utilized and accessed by students, recognizing that there are a number of barriers to reporting both of course, and not withstanding, sexualized violence, but across the whole spectrum of concerning and worrisome behaviors for students. There’s a lot of situations where they’re not going to feel comfortable coming forward, so that anonymous reporting tool is really a key piece of what that looks like. But I think, really expand

Sam Jingfors: What we’ve tried to accomplish is really to build upon getting beyond the internet safety, don’t talk to strangers online, and really getting into a lot more tangible conversations and messaging around real challenges that our students within the K to 12 sector are facing online. That would include, for example, discussing what do you do when you receive an inappropriate message from somebody you don’t know on Instagram Direct? What are the next steps? Because that is the reality that they’re facing day-to-day. It’s not a stranger in a chatroom, for example. It is a catfishing account created on Instagram that’s been built with the intent to want to solicit sexualized photos from some of our students that are vulnerable, certainly within our community. Solicit those, and then turn them around and create that into a sextortion related incident, which we can continue to support districts that are supporting students and helping students through dealing with that, and they are very, very messy cases. So, the more amount of awareness that we can put on the forefront, I think around prevention with realistic scenarios that they’re going to through, I think the better off ultimately we will be.

Sam Jingfors: One of the unique roles I think that we’ve been able to slot into in supporting districts across BC is really being their 24/7 go-to’s for incident specific issues that they’re dealing with, from the whole spectrum of, maybe it’s an impersonation account of a teacher or an administrator, for example, that’s causing a whole bunch of mischief throughout a specific community, to the tragic end of the spectrum around an attempted or completed suicide of a young person, and supporting the district through what that trauma response looks like. But more specifically on the digital side, trying to recognize what suicide contagion could look like within that school community to identify other students that may be escalating in their own grief, or exhibiting suicidal ideation, for example, so that we can work that back into the prevention loop to get them early supports before they continue down a pathway towards a bad place.

Sam Jingfors: So, a lot of our work is very much hands-on. We have eight full-time social media threat analysts that specialize in this field to be able to map out what those peer dynamics look like, for example, for gang prevention, to be able to identify what a sociogram looks like for a negative peer group or youth gang as it develops within a community so that we can have data driven prevention efforts that are based on being able to target interventions for the leader of that group, as opposed to the followers, for example.

Sam Jingfors: So, I want to show you a couple of case examples as we go on throughout today, but the reality, when I say digital threat assessment, it really has evolved out of the realm of behavioral threat and risk assessment. So, the model that is used across 90% of Canada is one that’s called Violence Threat Risk Assessment, throughout the province of British Columbia here, at least on the K to 12 sector. Very much established across the entire province for established procedures for assessing and responding to threat making and threat related behavior. PSIs I think over the last couple of years really have recognized of course that they’ve sort of been at arms length and separate from the K12, but ensuring that continuity from K12 to PSIs, especially as it relates to the worrisome and threat related behaviors I think is especially that much more important.

Sam Jingfors: So, just the basics around behavioral threat and risk assessment. As you’re seeing, it’s really the process that allows a multidisciplinary threat assessment team to make a objective, bless you, assessment around overall levels of risk as it relates to violence potential, which is really being able to share multisector, multidisciplinary information between policing partners, school partners, MCFD, Child and Youth Mental Health, for example. But also, a big part of that, as you can imagine, over the last number of years has been social media and the internet, and we’re really saying to our threat assessment teams, they’re recognizing you can’t do an accurate threat or risk assessment without considering what the digital baseline looks like for your threat maker, because they could be saying and manifesting one way in person, but then online it shares a completely different story.

Sam Jingfors: So really, that is where the field of digital threat assessment has evolved out of, recognizing that social media and the proliferation of technology and the internet across all of our lives, and certainly our students’ lives, has really had a tremendous impact on not only the way that students communicate, but also how mischief and threat related information is shared. So, this is one of the most common digital threats that we are continuing to support law enforcement agencies and school districts throughout this province with, which is some sort of iteration of this, a Snapchat threat that is fear mongering in nature, that is insidious that says, “Don’t come to school tomorrow. Something really bad is going to happen.”

Sam Jingfors: This then gets posted out onto Snapchat, which makes its way to Instagram, and then it ends up on Facebook, and all of sudden there’s moral panic pervasive throughout the whole school community, and school administrators, chiefs of police and superintendents are having to make a decision around, “Do we shut down our school?” Out of an abundance of caution. Which, I know Kwantlen very intimately faced that exact same decision around an evacuation relating to a school threat just last month. Prior to that was Langara with a little bit of a different detail.

Sam Jingfors: But, we’re really wanting to slow that process down and make a data driven assessment to that threat there so that we’re not overreacting to the emotional component around what we continue to see across North America, particularly south of the border, which is where I live. You know, the realistic threat of a school shooting, for example, particularly for students in the United States, is something that is realistically on students’ minds as they go to school, and that should never be acceptable, I think, as a society for us, which means we have to get back to some sort of normalcy relating to responding to these types of threats, which means the vast majority of these threats are not substantiated, and we want to be able to slow that process down.

Sam Jingfors: What we really throughout the erase strategy want to continue to foster is really getting back to the basics around culture and climate and the importance of that within schools, because I think even though I’ll focus certainly on this small snippet of time that I have on nerdy tech related digital components of this work, but I don’t want us to lose site of what’s important, and I truly believe, as all of you know, that work on the front line, the importance of relationships between certainly support staff, adults in general, and students, is one of the most profound prevention techniques that we have on our side. Because when we continue to look at the research around, from the FBI and the Secret Service around, is there a profile for a school shooter? Which of course there isn’t, but there are a number of common characteristics that are in play for each of them. One of them that always stands out to be profoundly insightful is each of those school killers lacked a healthy attachment to a positive adult role model in their life. They didn’t have anyone in their corner continuing to encourage them to get back up and to be resilient. So, that relationship piece can’t be overlooked within schools.

Sam Jingfors: But just to be able to speak to a couple of those We’re going to have questions at the end, if you don’t mind. Thank you. A couple of those data driven pieces around digital threat assessment. If this lands on the desk of a law enforcement officer or one of our school staff members, certainly elevating it up and getting police involved is going to be important, but wanting to make a data driven assessment to this. One of those data driven assessment pieces that we talk about in digital threat assessment is really questioning that image and the authenticity and the credibility of that image, and conducting Well, asking, really, is that a real gun or is that a fake gun? Or in other words, is this a unique image, I.e. an actual gun that is at home of the threat maker that they just took a picture of, or is this a stock image, one that’s been sourced from the internet, downloaded from another area of the internet? There’s a very easy, credible way that we can test that, and how we do that is through a technique called a reverse image search.

Sam Jingfors: So, we crop and isolate that image, and then instead of going to Google and searching for TEC-9 or Uzi guns, we are taking that image, isolating it, cropping it, and then running it as a reverse image search by saying, “Hey, Google, have you ever seen this image, and if so, where? Show us exactly where if any you’ve seen this exact imagine.” Which of course the results for this image gives us 289 results, indicating and giving us confirmation that it is in fact a stock image, with pages that include matching images telling us that exact image has been matched on all these other websites. So, it’s confirmation that it is in fact a stock image, which reduces the level of risk, at least initially. Police are still responding accordingly and being able to search the residence of the threat maker for access to the means, because that’s a key variable, of course, as it relates to threat making behavior is, “Does the threat maker possess access to the means to carry out that threat?”

Sam Jingfors: But, this at least gives us a very quick determination for law enforcement to be able to know they’re not dealing, for example, with that exact gun at home, for example. It doesn’t mean there isn’t other access to the means. But, we can also use that technique for a whole variety of different images to determine whether they’re stock or unique. So, if you’re working with a young person exhibiting suicidal ideation or self harming behaviors, to be able to credibly test the validity of that image by conducting a reverse image search is an option that’s available to us as well, which of course we find out in this case that it is in fact a stock image, that there’s four other results after searching almost 35 billion images that are openly and publicly available.

Sam Jingfors: We do, though, want to be able to pick up on whether it has been tweaked at all. As you can see, what if a caption is now drawn over top of that self harming cuts on an arm, for example? Does that change the results? Which in this case, it doesn’t. It still says the original is a stock image and it was sourced from the internet. But if you compare the two results that are there, the one on the bottom, that’s the original image with self harm cuts on a wrist, but at the top, the one that we uploaded, has a caption over top in the middle. So, our hypotheses would be originally it was a stock image, and now it’s now unique, drawn with a caption over top of it.

Sam Jingfors: So, I’ve selected a couple of key pieces that I wanted to touch base on recognizing what the mission of this forum is. Especially for those of you working with survivors or those fleeing sexualized violence, for example, there are a number of technology components that I think we certainly want to be aware of. I think one of the foundational ones is with the very sophisticated devices that we all have in our hands, there are a number of geolocational components that are integral to its operation. But of course, with those come a number of risks when it comes to supporting those that are fleeing violence. So, I wanted to touch on a couple of those, and then probably on a couple of protective steps as well.

Sam Jingfors: So, for those of us that have Apple devices, for example, key feature to be able to source the actual location of where that device is is to be able to utilize Find My iPhone, for example. So, if you have passwords to be able to get into iCloud, you can easily see, provided that feature’s turned on, which it is for 98% of the Apple devices that are out there, where exactly that device is on a map right now, for example, which of course is valuable if you lose or your gets stolen, for example, to be able to remotely erase that device if needed from there. But be mindful that, as it’s still connected to the network, you can at least see where it last was on a map.

Sam Jingfors: We also talk, certainly on the investigative side working with police, but also responding to school safety issues, the importance of metadata on photographs, for example. The reality is, every single one of us that take photos on our smartphone, it embeds an ocean of data below the surface of each of those photos. Really how much information, as in everything or really nothing, is all based on one light switch feature within our settings, which is geolocation as it relates to our camera. But a couple of rules to remember about metadata specifically is social media platforms strip metadata off of photos, and we’d expect that as a user of that platform. You wouldn’t want me to be able to go to your Facebook page, right click save as on your family photo, and then view exactly the geolocation of where your house of where you uploaded that photo from. We’d expect that as a user, right? So, anything that passes through social media, whether it be Snapchat, Instagram, Facebook, YouTube, there’s no inherent metadata that we can access from the outside.

Sam Jingfors: Having said that, we’ve identified a couple of ways where you can access metadata. One is if you have access to the device itself, you can look at the metadata below the surface as all of you can on your device. But, we’ve also identified three different transmission methods by which metadata doesn’t inherently get stripped off, and that’s if photos are texted, emailed, or airdropped. Texted, emailed or airdropped it doesn’t get compressed and metadata is still viewable below the surface, provided that feature is on, which it is for the vast majority of us. So, I took this photo here. One of our other initiatives that Scott mentioned is gang reduction through informed practice, which is a multiyear strategy with the PSSG, Public Safety and Solicitor General.

Sam Jingfors: So, I took this photo at their media announcement, and when we look at the metadata below the surface of that photo, this is how much we can see about that one particular photo and the device that it was taken on. So, we can see the exact device, Apple iPhone 8+. So, it wasn’t a Samsung Galaxy, it wasn’t an iPad, it wasn’t an SLR camera. It was taken with the back camera, not the front. It wasn’t a selfie. The flash didn’t fire. It was taken March 12th at 11:33 in the morning, and 50 seconds. The latitude and the longitude is there, as well as the altitude and the camera direction, pointing northwest. So, we can plot those exact coordinates on a map down to specifically within what area of the building that photo was taken. That is the inherent ability to be able to plot and view metadata on photos, which means we really, for those of you that work with victims and survivors fleeing violence, this is going to be a key factor around protecting their safety, to be able to turn this feature off and have that data not inherently put on every single photo that’s there.

Sam Jingfors: We also, because we have GPS built in there, we also have an approximate speed that’s embedded on the photo as well. So, you can imagine where we’ve used this investigatively working with police agencies when they’ve had distracted driving causing death investigations, for example, where someone’s driving down the highway and they take photos of the beautiful mountains outside. Not paying attention to the road in front of them, they veer onto the shoulder and run over a cyclist that’s out for their morning cycle, tragically killing them. They’re trying to figure out whether they can leverage an aggravated charge relating to speed. There was really no way to be able to prove it other than the metadata of the five photos that were taken prior to that accident.

Sam Jingfors: Another very quick example, as well. Think about how many times we post something for sale on Craigslist or on Facebook buy and sell, for example. The good news is, metadata is stripped off at the source, at Facebook, right? But, think where a lot of those conversations lead into. Typically text message or email, right? “Text me what time I can come pick this up. Send me the address. Oh, by the way, could you take a couple of larger photos? I can’t really see if there’s a scratch on the side of that TV,” motorcycle, whatever it is. “Yeah, sure.” Take, take, send, send. So, you’ve left the safe haven of Facebook or Craigslist that would strip it, and you’ve now entered into a vulnerable discourse which is text message. So, now that means the recipient, if they were smart and knew where to look, they’d be able to say, “Oh, I don’t feel like actually purchasing this and paying for it. Why don’t I just wait until you go to work and break in and steal it?” Yikes. So, are you paranoid yet?

Sam Jingfors: How about I’ll start with this. A proactive way to be able to turn that one feature off. That’s your homework, to go into your settings on your iPhone, for example, go into privacy, go to location services and go to your camera and turn location off as it relates to never. It’s either never or while using. While using means every single photo you take embeds that amount of data below the surface. Same thing with Android. If you go to your camera as if you’re about to take a picture, you go to the settings wheel and look at all the settings that pop up and turn off location tags.

Sam Jingfors: Very quickly, as well. I mean, we could also play the game of how much your smartphone knows about you, because there’s actually another additional feature within the iPhone, for example, that tracks where you frequently travel throughout a community so as to give you real time informed suggestions on travel time, for example. Right? You’ll find that by digging even deeper below the surface, by going privacy, location services. Also, by the way, while you’re there I’d stop in and take a peek into microphone and see which apps actually have access to your microphone. I would argue Candy Crush doesn’t need access to your microphone. Do they want it? Absolutely. They want to be able to say that in Richmond here there’s 700 people that are playing Candy Crush right now, it’s almost lunchtime, let’s target them with an advertisement for a pizza shop that’s down the street, for example. That’s how they can use informed data to be able to target targeted marketing and advertising.

Sam Jingfors: But, it also means that, if you’re taking to your friend about Lululemon shorts that they should buy, for example, because you swear by them, it means likely when they’re scrolling through Instagram later, they might see a targeted advertisement for those exact Lululemon shorts. So, go into microphone and make sure You only need to allow the apps that actually credibly need access to your location. Or your microphone, pardon me. Below that, if you go all the way down to the bottom of all of your apps and take a look at system services, then look at what’s called significant locations. It used to be called frequent locations, which is why I show you this. It’s the same data. Once you click on that, it will show you where you frequently have traveled throughout your community. Please promise me that you’ll use these powers for good and not for evil. What I mean by that specifically is when you go home and say hello to your significant other, please don’t say, “My phone died on the way home. Can I borrow yours for a second?” Then you go in there and look for dinner table conversation topics. Because it has the degree of detail down to the minute of where you specifically were at various locations.

Sam Jingfors: So, let’s think back to our work supporting those that are fleeing violence. This is going to be a key factor. Now, what has countered this has been biometric scanning, like not just having a password to be able to enter a phone, but using your fingerprint and using face ID to open a phone has really curbed a lot of the concerns relating to this. But still, to be able to know where location tracking is actually stored locally within the phone is going to be important.

Sam Jingfors: There’s also Google location history. Google has a lot of information about all of us, of course. But if you go to, for example, it should show you every single Google search you’ve ever done. Yikes. Maybe that’s too much info. But it also means, again, back to our work, if you’re logged in in two different computers or on two different devices, you can access this data around what was searched, but also location history of where you’ve used Google Maps to be able to travel from point A to point B, for example. Which of course can be highly revealing in terms of where you are at that exact moment.

Sam Jingfors :So, jumping now to the two most popular platforms that our K to 12 students, and I would say beyond that into PSI age students into young adults, is going to be Instagram and Snapchat, number one and number two, and they go back and forth in terms of popularity. A key piece for us working with schools is certainly to understand what some of the key factors around Instagram, especially as it relates to child exploitation. Some of the factors that go along with the pervasiveness of sexting and sextortion related cases. An acknowledgement, first of all, that it’s not uncommon for our students to have several different Instagram accounts to their name. Right? They’ll have their main account, but then they’ll have their spam account or their secondary account or multiple other ones where maybe it doesn’t meet the threshold for perceived popularity, which there’s a lot of drama and expectations and pressure around Instagram.

Sam Jingfors: They’ve been tricked into thinking the more people following you comparative to the number of people you’re following is more important, so you need to have higher, higher numbers. But because of that, if you’re trying to find their other alias accounts, for example, you can also click on the followers list of their main account, because quite often they will follow themselves because it is a boost in numbers. So, trying to understand, for example, getting back to establishing a digital baseline of a threat maker, we’re wanting to locate other accounts that they’ve been using to establish a digital baseline.

Sam Jingfors: I pulled a couple of examples of sexualized exploitation, for example, of young people, where this young person was actually selling sexting related photos through Instagram stories, as you can see, and I’m highly concerned just looking at this as you are around the risk of sexualized targeted violence and child exploitation relating to a young person actually going out of their way to sell their own explicit photos, for example.

Sam Jingfors: We always ask students, “Hey, is this catfishing?” They laugh, and of course they say no, because they know catfishing to be this, to be a fake account that was created on Instagram, for example. So, here’s a real life case file from here in British Columbia of a Instagram profile as you’re seeing here that was able to message over 150 young girls between the ages of 10, 11, and 12, all within three specific neighboring communities using various child grooming narratives around, “I just moved into the town next to you,” for example. “Do you want to be friends?” Et cetera. All of that communication, by the way, was happening through Instagram Direct, which again, for those of you working with clients for example, or even have kids of your own, recognize that Instagram is a photo sharing application, but the majority of youth communication is happening through a private message mailbox called Instagram Direct, one to one communication.

Sam Jingfors: So again, on the prevention the side, the more information I think we can give our kids at a younger age around the risks involved in sending explicit or inappropriate photos of your self and how, of course, it comes back to bite you later on, and you don’t have a second chance to change your mind. All of the factors and key messaging that is part of the messaging that we do with the student sessions throughout the province, really trying to make sure that instead of, “No, no, no. Don’t do it.” Just make an informed decision before you do it. So, we have some curriculum and slides that we built that we’re happy to share with any of you that can empower someone within your team to be able to really try and get this awareness out there as it relates to trying to prevent sexualized child exploitation, for example.

Sam Jingfors: Snapchat. Right? So, this little ghost here, again, came out in 2011 with the promise that you could send a photo and have it disappear on the recipient’s end in 10 seconds or less, so that galvanized certainly the way that youth communicate, and it continues to be the way that students will communicate one to one to each other. So, just a couple of pieces around that, because I want to talk about how you can use this to be able to harness public safety related information and support those fleeing violence. Once you take a photo, you can choose whether to send this to one or all of your contacts, in which case you can set the timer for one to ten seconds for how long it can be viewed on the recipient’s end, and then you hit send. It pops up on their side, sits there like an unread email until you open it. Once you open it, that’s when the timer starts, one to ten seconds. Or you can choose to add this to your story. Your story is kind of like a highlight reel of your day, and it’s viewable for 24 hours after you’ve posted it. So, everything about the app is ephemeral. It’s short lasting. It’s not meant to be permanent, as opposed to some of the other social media platforms.

Sam Jingfors: This is Theresa Campbell, the president of our company, her daughter. This is her stats on the number of photos that she has sent and received since she has downloaded Snapchat. So, that gives you an idea really around the volume of communication that’s being sent back and forth, because it’s not highly curated photos, right? I think the paradigm shift with Snapchat was all of us in this room used to use cameras to take photos of things that mattered, right? We’d get everyone together and we’d say, “Okay, pose, and Bryan, don’t yawn this time, and here we go.” Right? But our kids are walking down the hallways of our schools taking photos of their feet, for example, writing a message across the middle and hitting send. So, it’s not highly curated, and Snapchat really has made communication, I think, a lot more vivid and a lot more fun for our students.

Sam Jingfors: Of course, there are a couple of features that make Snapchat worth, I think only a couple, that make it worth its astronomical evaluation as an IPO. Last spring, with their IPO, the initial public offering, they became a publicly traded company at a valuation of $36 billion. There’s a number of reasons. I mean, they’re not worth that by any stretch of the imagination. They’re a unicorn company. But, tech company. But, they’ll do things like integrate a feature like this, like Snap [inaudible 00:43:04], for example. Right? Which is a cumulative total of the number of days consecutively that you and your friend have sent at least one Snapchat per day to each other without fail. So, if you’ve gone 24 hours and one second over that time limit, the streak disappears, which means anxiety rises, right? As you now start to confiscate phones away from your children, for example, because they’ve been tricked into thinking there’s this compulsive need to go back the app every single day. By the way, genius move on Snapchat’s part, right, to be able to keep the dopamine going and keep that dopamine loop ongoing.

Sam Jingfors: But when we’re trying to understand the relationship dynamics between individuals, if you look at those Snapchat emojis that are designated next to each individual. If you check the guide around what it actually means, it’s quite insightful and alarming at the same time. You’re their best friend but they aren’t your best friend. What? You’re someone they send the most snaps to, but they aren’t someone you send snaps to the most. Okay. All right. So, as I interpret it, you’re basically cheating on your best friend. You have a different best friend than They are your best See, I don’t even get it, right? But, this causes relationship dynamic drama between students, as you can possibly imagine. But, back to cute things, of course. You can have puppy dog emoji over you face, and that video went sideways, so that’s okay. You can swap faces with somebody next to you, right? So if you were curious about what Bradgelina looks like, you could swap their faces and find out. But, there’s been some weird ones that have come out, truly. I think we need to keep baby, baby and grandpa, grandpa. Technology is fantastic.

Sam Jingfors :One of the things we really need to keep in mind, actually two years ago now this summer, Snapchat came out with a feature called Snap Map, which allows students to be able to quite literally geolocate their friends on a map in real time. This has had The reason they were able to do it? They purchased a company called Zenly for about $300 million. What it tangibly allows students to be able to do is see where their friends are as represented by their Bit emojis, little carton characters, are on a map in real time. Which is, of course, great for them if they want to see where everyone’s hanging out at. But for us on the professional support side, to be able to geolocate a suicidal or a missing student, for example, is highly valuable, to be able to ask, for example

Sam Jingfors: I’ll give you a real example. A police officer who attended our course called me three weeks later and said, “Sam, I really enjoyed your course. Most of it over my head. But, I remembered one thing that you said, Snap Map, and just awareness around that one feature saved a grade 9 girl’s life this morning.” I said, “Wow. Tell me about it?” He said, “Two of her friends came down to the office and said she’s been expressing suicidal ideation throughout the night. She’s saying her goodbyes. She’s not here at school thus far today. We’re really worried about her.” He said, “Thank you. Okay. Can you show me?” Can you show me? Again, that one question, going back to the importance of the relationship, because we wouldn’t be able to access that on the outside, the open source side, because it’s all privileged, one to one private communication.

Sam Jingfors: So, to be able to ask, “Can you show me?” Absolutely. Document it with a secondary device so as not to notify the author or the sender, which is important for threat related cases that you’ve taken a screenshot, because if you screenshot through Snapchat itself, it’ll notify the sender that you’ve taken a screenshot. He then saw it and then he said, “Can you open up Snap Map?” Then they did, and they were able to see her little Bit emoji was on a map at a residence that wasn’t her own. So, they had already dispatched a police car to go to her residence based on MyEd, based on where the address was. They sent another one to this resident, which was actually a grandmother’s house. Student was at a grandmother’s house upstairs in the washroom tangibly planning the final steps in her own suicide. He swears that the ability to be able to see her Bit emoji on the map quite literally saved her life.

Sam Jingfors: So, that truly is the gist of what our training hopes to support, is new and innovative ways to be able to not only document and support followup as it relates to concerning and worrisome behaviors displayed within schools, but have good data driven assessments to violence potential as it relates to behavioral threat and risk assessment, because that truly is the missing link for violence prevention as it relates to violent conduct. Here’s an example of what we recommend in terms of with a Snapchat related content, to be able to document it without actually notifying the author.

Sam Jingfors: Here was just a couple of proactive means around how we can continue, all of us, but including those of us, for those that work with those fleeing violence to be able to have a good understanding around passwords, having complex passwords and different passwords for each of your accounts is really important. Of course, passwords are, let’s be honest, are a challenge for all of us to remember, right? I don’t purport to be able to remember any more than you can, but I do use a password manager, because that allows you, for example, to create a password as you see on the right and store that for an account that you just created, where it generates a random 18 digit both numbers, special characters and letters password, and then saves it. You never need to remember that password. You just need to remember to have your thumbprint that opens that app, because for each of those, you can just put in You just hit copy and paste, copy and paste each time.

Sam Jingfors: It really allows and prevents for misuse of technology as it relates to suspects and perpetrators being able to access victims’ and survivors’ technological devices. Having complex passwords, using 2FA, two factor authentication, by being able to send a text code to your phone, and have that authenticate into the account you’re trying to log into so that you always have your device with you, for example, and you can log out of all active sessions. That’s a big one. We used to, like maybe 10 years ago, you’d log in on the library or an internet café computer and then forget to log out, and then someone would come in after and cause some havoc. Now it really comes down to, where have you logged in on various devices in the past, and where has it remembered your password? So, to be able to go in and get a fresh slate by hitting log out of all active sessions, it’s going to log you out of all those devices that you’ve logged into in the past, and then you do a fresh login just so that you can have a fresh stance moving forward with that particular account.

Sam Jingfors: So, I want to really, with that short amount of time that I had, give you a couple of sort of key pieces of insight into the training that we deliver throughout this province supporting K to 12 districts and really hoping to bridge that connection over to the PSI side as well, because I think there’s certainly some unique dynamics that all of you are facing within your current roles, but I think the technology application of social media, digital devices, needs to be part of that conversation, because it can really help inform data driven approaches to prevention. So, I’ll leave it there. I know we have Maybe open it up if there’s any specific questions, and then we can go from there. Yes?

Speaker 5: I’m just curious, because I know I get all the tech stuff. I graduated like three years ago. I know I’m super young. Sorry. I’m just wondering how and if all of that training that you do and the technology being used is being used in relation to risk assessment, prevention and response to sexualized violence specifically? I was particularly interested to know how you’ll respond to my question regarding what you said about photos and photo sharing, and students who share explicit photos. What kind of messaging goes along with that education in terms of victim blaming if there’s an instance where inappropriate photos are sent and later that student is victimized?

Sam Jingfors: Yeah, great question. First of all, don’t ever apologize for being young. We’re typical Canadian, right? We say sorry for everything. I do the same thing. But, thank you for your insight. Yeah, it’s a really good question. I think a lot of the messaging around having that victim centered approach when it comes to the awareness piece and wanting to get good information out there so that you’re not compounding the problem by victim blaming, and putting a lot more blame on the victim’s side. So, I think that is certainly one of the things that we’re considering as we’re delivering information. Yeah.

Sam Jingfors: Yeah. You know, we don’t have training that’s specific to that vertical. I was trying to really excerpt a lot of the key tenants and try and put them into an informed practice around the response based approaches to sexualized violence. So, I was trying to extract a couple of key technological pieces that could be translated into your field of work, for example, knowing that it doesn’t relate specifically, perhaps.

Scott Beddall: Sure I can make that work. I think that’s one of the pieces of work we’re hoping to do with the Kamloops school district as well, because they have taken quite a lead role in working across sectors around sexual violence and sexual misconduct specifically, and starting to develop some resources. So, that’s where we’re looking to work with them and our Safer Schools Together partners and the Office of the Ombudsperson Prevention to look at, what does that look like in terms of integration into our existing sort of training offerings? Something new. So, you know, I think at the end of it we’re also at some of the early stages some of this piece of work, and so not trying to convey that we’ve got it all figured out by any stretch, but it’s definitely something that we’re looking to work with a few partners on in terms of how to get to a better place around it.

Speaker 6: Hi. My question is more relating to Scott’s presentation, and I was wondering what supports you have in place for rural communities that have high increased amounts of trauma, a lack of community supports, and a high teacher turnover, so the teachers, they pretty much come because they can only get a job there and they leave as soon as they can go to a better urban center. So, is there additional supports for those kind of communities through your programming?

Scott Beddall: Yeah. I’d say one of the things we’re trying to look to do is supporting the development of some regional teams, because that’s one of the things we’re recognizing is that there’s huge variation from one district to another in terms of their internal resources, and totally appreciate the challenges of that face of, like when we look at say what Surrey has compared to some of those communities, it’s not at all comparable. But, we’re starting to look at You know, we’d done this informally in looking at maybe ways to formalize a little bit more about getting districts to being able to share some of their services and supports. Bringing in, like literally bringing in some of their counseling supports or other service providers from one district to another.Scott Beddall:So, that’s one piece, and then also having Safer Schools Together and some of those provincial level supports whereby Some of the bigger districts that have been doing this work for a while, they don’t call Safer Schools Together very often. Some of the smaller ones call more, and that’s great, because we’re not looking to make it just completely uniform of, you know, you’ll only get X amount of hours each. You need more help, you get more help. So, I think there’s a few things we’re trying to work around that, and again, I’m not trying to suggest we’ve got it all mastered by any stretch, but it’s a great question, a great point that we need to continue to work on in terms of that equity there.

Speaker 6: Yeah. I’m just from the north island, so it’s like the amount of supports that we have is kind of lacking in some areas, so it’s kind of interesting to have more perspective in comparison to urban areas.

Speaker 7: Hi. This is kind of a little bit off topic maybe, but I’m just kind of curious within your Safer Schools Together program, if you think that there’s room for more consent and sexual health education, just because I think that, specifically since we’re talking about sexualized violence, that stuff has to start at like day one basically, and I know it’s quite variable between districts and schools. Like, I’m from [inaudible 00:55:22]. I know we just lost a great sex educator from our district, and there’s been a lot of talk about that lately, and I’m just kind of wondering if you see in the future that being something that you have a part in as well.

Sam Jingfors: Yeah, absolutely. It is something that I think is key to be able to have grassroots, peer driven, peer led, train the trainer type models, and that’s something that the Ministry of Education has supported us in the past, and I think it’s something we want to continue to do is integrate grassroots level information and input from stakeholders. Yeah, absolutely.

Speaker 7: That’s awesome to hear, because yeah, we’re doing a lot of education at the post-secondary level, obviously, but it’s stuff that people could’ve learned a long time ago, and I think that makes a big difference, so thank you.

Scott Beddall: Just to add to that, because I touched on it very briefly, but in the new physical health education curriculum, it covers a range of topics. So, mental health, healthy relationships, sexual health, and early days still. It’s been around, you know, for about two years now. But, sexual health education is in the top two areas where teachers are looking for more supports. So, our curriculum division at the Ministry is bringing together a group of teachers to look at particularly those two areas to start to pull together some evidence based best practice resource and then look at how to make those accessible to all educators. We know there’s some areas that are doing some tremendous work, like Langley School District and Fraser Health Authority have recently been working a ton to pull together like a massive repository of really quality resources ranging from instructional samples to actual service providers who can come in, and books and everything. So, we recognize that there is a gap. As I mentioned, when some of the traditional approaches don’t get into those important pieces like consent and things, so really looking and we need to up our game in that area for sure.

Speaker 8: Hello. So, I have a quick question for both of you folks. So, Scott. Yeah. I’m curious if you’ve had conversations with your equivalent on the Ministry of Higher Ed, because it sounds like we’re just recreating the wheel at two ministries, and I’m confused if our language is going to be different when the students are in like K to 12. Sorry. I thought this conversation was going to be about how we were transitioning our K to 12 students to our post-secondary environment, and it seemed kind of a little bit more of a show and tell of what you’re doing, and I’m just curious if your Ministry has reached out to the Higher Ed. Or, you’re talking about Kamloops? Thompson Rivers is in the space right now, so I’m just curious, where’s that bridge between the school districts and our institutions?

Scott Beddall: Great question. So, we have been engaging with our team over at Advanced Education on a couple of fronts. One is around the student safety piece, but on another case it’s the mental health work that’s happening, and again, some of that’s happening cross government. So, I think that’s one of the things we recognized is we’re at an early stage here, where actually have had some of those early conversations of, “What specifically could we be doing to support the transitions?” I think it was your team that mentioned a lot of the Some of the incidents happen within the first six weeks, if I remember that correctly, of coming into post-secondary. So, on all these fronts, I think that’s where we’re looking forward to ideas both from each other’s ministries, but also from the school districts and the post-secondary institutions of what exactly is needed. I don’t think we’re coming in that we’ve got all the answers, but definitely recognizing that collaborative work is going to be key for sure.

Scott Beddall: Sure. Mm-hmm (affirmative).

Speaker 9: [inaudible 00:59:44]

Scott Beddall: For sure, and I think that’s the piece again, drawing it back to the Kamloops school district, they’re starting to do a lot of that work. We’re looking to work with them, and I think it would be a great opportunity, because I actually had invited them to come to this, too. Unfortunately, they were unavailable. But, it would make a ton of sense if we’re all working on that together verse I completely hear you. Why would we work totally in isolation? Yeah, would be totally open to that. To your point about other opportunities to kind of engage more in a dialogue, both Sam and I, I think speaking for both of us, would be absolutely happy to engage if there’s other opportunities for us to come to something where we can talk about that, or bring a meeting together. We’d be all over that, so.

Sam Jingfors: Yeah. [crosstalk 01:00:34]

Anna Elaine: I think we’re going to have one more question before you need to start moving on. [inaudible 01:00:43]

Speaker 11: Hi, folks. Thank you so much for your presentation. I think what I’m hearing from some folks in the room is that the reality is that there’s a quite a lot of disparity between what you folks are talking about and the experiences that we’re having in higher education, and some of the approaches that we’re taking. So, based on that, one of the things that I wanted to do was just to reach out to some of my colleagues who are actually teachers in the K to 12 space who are invested in these types of issues to get their perspectives and to bring those voices into the room that aren’t here. I’ve actually been working with some of them on a grant application to do some work with the Burnaby School District. So, I’m curious, when you talk about this notion of maintaining school safety and the SLOs, which are situated within schools, so having police officers in schools, where the data is to suggest that that’s actually a practice to maintain safety?

Speaker 11: Because I have a friend, one of these colleagues who’s a part of the BCTF Women of Color Caucus who’s doing research into that, and she can’t find the data, and I have consent to say this, by the way. She can’t find that data because the reality is is that it’s actually reinforcing surveillance of particularly racialized and indigenous kids, and actually reinforcing the prison pipeline, the education to prison pipeline. Right? So, I’m just really curious, like as we’re having these conversations about maintaining school safety, what the need is for the SLOs, how that’s trauma informed, and how that’s actually impacting these students that at some point may come to our institutions as well. So, that’s one thing to consider. Then the other piece as well is I kept hearing the word mischief sued. Sorry, my accent’s a bit strange, but the mischief used throughout this presentation. Like, what are you defining as mischief? Right? Within this conversation I think over the first few days, we’ve talked a lot about harm, right, and I find the use of that problematic, as well as the fact that you’re showing very graphic images of self harm without any trigger warnings whatsoever. So, also, I’d like you to consider, when we talk about [inaudible 01:02:49] informed practice, this notion of shock and awe. Yeah, that was a lot of stuff to say, but I think there is a lot to be said about your presentation, and some concerns as well.

Scott Beddall: That is actually really helpful feedback, so thank you. It helps us to inform sort of how we carry things forward in terms of those. The first part, the very first part that you mentioned. Sorry, could you just reiterate that for a moment.

Speaker 11:It was why is there police officers-

Scott Beddall: SLOs.

Speaker 11: in schools, how is that maintaining safety?

Scott Beddall: Right. I think one of the things that we’re trying to do with the law enforcement side is, rather than recommend a particular model. So, when I talked about the drafts, the school police provincial guidelines, it’s really about looking at how can the two sectors work together in a way that best supports the youth and the families? So, even in those guidelines, it’s not that every school should have SLOs, necessarily. That should be the model. But it’s really trying to get to a foundational like, “How should we be working together? What are those sort of factors we’re considering?”

Scott Beddall: I think as we sort of continue to revisit that, because it will be a provincially published piece, opportunities to make improvements on that, we’d be absolutely You know, would welcome that type of feedback. And, yeah, we’re very interested in terms of trying to use data to inform the decision. So, I’m not sure where it came up in terms of SLOs being sort of promoted as the model, but that’s not kind of in what we’re doing in terms of our cross sector work at a provincial level, I guess, getting into that level. If that makes sense.

Scott Beddall: Oh, I see. In terms of this is where the conversation tends to go on the front line type of thing? Oh, I see. Yeah. Yeah. I think there can be a lot of variation between what that relationship looks like, like in terms of how it’s working for the community, from one to another. So, I think, yeah, there’s more work for us to be doing there, but very insightful, and thank you for the comments on that.

Anna Elaine: All right. I think we’re going to close this off, and thank you very much for the information, for the presentation, and thank you very much to everyone for your questions as well. We are going to move into an assessment and some overview from the feedback that we’ve gathered on all of our boards. That’s going to be done by BC Campus right now. Thank you very much.

Robynne Devine: Okay. So, we actually only have a few minutes to kind of debrief the gallery, and there’s some amazing themes that are showing up on those boards. So, I was going to ask you all to divide into three groups and gather in front of a board, and if we could just take five minutes and maybe amongst your groups have a recorder and then a reporter outer, and let’s just get a little bit of a three to five themes that you’re noticing on each board so that we have some key themes and priorities that you all feel are the most important out of all of these things, and then we’ll just get you to use the flip charts on the side sot hat we can keep all the other data that’s on there for us to go back and reflect on as we move forward. So, let’s just kind of pick a board and we’ll do five minutes, and then we’ll just do some quick round report out.

Group:[inaudible 01:08:51]

Group:[inaudible 01:09:38]